had to share this hand

[68allin]

Nice One mole

[the mole]

Originally Posted by glceud

Still not sure I like the all in shove though.

Can i ask why you don't like this move
imo it was the only move possible, kill the pot right away

[glceud]

I wouldnt want to kill a pot I had dominated like this one , if he was on A/k or A/q he would have folded to your all in. If he did he might have tried a continuation bet on the turn if you had just called or he might have hit one of his percieved 6 outs and then you would have had him all in anyway. Even if he had jj or qq he might have folded to your all in by putting you on possible kings.
No doubt killing the pot is the right play but you could only really have him on runner outs or 2 cards to make an over set, thankfully his hand was good enough to calll you with and you made the maximum out of it
Would you have called with kings in that position?

[WASP]

Originally Posted by the mole

Can i ask why you don't like this move
imo it was the only move possible, kill the pot right away

Nothing IMO

Different people play in different ways but most in this thread are 'speculating' with cold facts. You maybe had more information through playing hands with these guys and a faint heart never fcuked a fair maiden (as they say in Cheshire)

[the mole]

Originally Posted by glceud

I wouldnt want to kill a pot I had dominated like this one , if he was on A/k or A/q he would have folded to your all in. If he did he might have tried a continuation bet on the turn if you had just called or he might have hit one of his percieved 6 outs and then you would have had him all in anyway. Even if he had jj or qq he might have folded to your all in by putting you on possible kings.
No doubt killing the pot is the right play but you could only really have him on runner outs or 2 cards to make an over set, thankfully his hand was good enough to calll you with and you made the maximum out of it
Would you have called with kings in that position?

Firstly at the point of going all in there was 4k in the pot so winning it there and then is key.

secondly i didnt think at all what he had as i had the nuts at that point, if i let another card out i might not have the nuts anymore and have now lost the power

next there were 2 spades on the flop he couldve been drawing so all in was without a doubt the play

you actually need to play at this level to understand that its all about power, and you have no idea the pressure on you at all times

the pot at this level is worth winning from the off, so really no need to take chances in trying to build it

poker at a good level cannot be played from a book!!!

cheers mcfc couldn't have said it better masell

[the mole]

Oh and by the way i don't know if i would have called as you've got to be in the position to answer that

its possible he put me on the nut flush draw, ace ten, an overpair or a big fat bluff

[Valiant23]

you actually need to play at this level to understand that its all about power, and you have no idea the pressure on you at all times

the pot at this level is worth winning from the off, so really no need to take chances in trying to build it

poker at a good level cannot be played from a book!!!

The truth is we can only imagine the stresses you suffer from at times, although having watched you and realised the sum's of money being 'chucked about' at times I have a fairly good idea.

I've though about it for a while Mole, and I think it could be just me, but I don't know how you cope because I'm not sure that I could. However I'm on your side when I say that I don't think many people could.

As regards the hand I saw nothing at all that I would have done different, except the first flat call (I'd be interested in why you did do that rather than raise?).

fcuk the plays and %'s, man you must have balls the size of the millenium dome

[the mole]

Originally Posted by Valiant23

As regards the hand I saw nothing at all that I would have done different, except the first flat call (I'd be interested in why you did do that rather than raise?).

The reason i did not raise is because Mr AKI raises 99.9% of the time, he was on my left and did so , if tamtam had not re raised i would have.

cheers all for the good wishes

[Valiant23]

Sounds good.

[glceud]

OK so you wanted to win 4k, with that hand I would have wanted his entire stack. You got lucky in as much as he had only one of two hands he could call you with that you had dominated.
Any other hand bar the flush draw he would have more than likely have folded. Even jacks or queens.
Let him have another card, he might have paired his a/k or a/q or tried another continuation bet.
All I said was that his call was correct and that I would have played it differently and in a massive % of the time I would win more money than u would have there if his cards were other than kings or aces. in those cases we both win the same amount or go bust. OK I might go bust to runner runner Straights or flushes if he is on 2 other cards but that is a chance worth taking.
You make a big deal of the stakes involved, well one mans dollar is another mans dime
We all know you are a winning player, well so am I but unless someone bankrolls me you will always be better than me

[glceud]

As for playing poker from a book when I started playing there was only 2 books on poker in print, no magazines, tv shows, no dvds, no poker software to work out you plays and definately no poker forums.
Sklansky's holdem poker for advanced players was out of print and interestingly there was only one copy in the whole UK library system.

[the mole]

Originally Posted by glceud

OK so you wanted to win 4k, with that hand I would have wanted his entire stack. You got lucky in as much as he had only one of two hands he could call you with that you had dominated.
Any other hand bar the flush draw he would have more than likely have folded. Even jacks or queens.
Let him have another card, he might have paired his a/k or a/q or tried another continuation bet.
All I said was that his call was correct and that I would have played it differently and in a massive % of the time I would win more money than u would have there if his cards were other than kings or aces. in those cases we both win the same amount or go bust. OK I might go bust to runner runner Straights or flushes if he is on 2 other cards but that is a chance worth taking.
You make a big deal of the stakes involved, well one mans dollar is another mans dime
We all know you are a winning player, well so am I but unless someone bankrolls me you will always be better than me

As you have never played at this level you clearly have no idea what your talking about, if you like to play slow then i'm not surprised you need bankrolled. i on the other hand have built my stack this year starting with £50.what you have to remember is i have played at every level, so therefore am in a position to say it is completley different at this level

Don't want to appear arrogant or offend you but you really must learn to adapt and open your mind to improve

[the mole]

You only seem to play the cards, there are a huge number of other factors you must take into account , the table , the players, things that happened previous, its better to win 4k than risk losing 10, etc too many too mention but these factors can be more important than the cards

as for the book reading thing , i have never read a poker book and don't intend to as i find its better to learn from your mistakes

[glceud]

Guess I played this hand all wrong then


Game #1811752221 - (blinds $0.50/$1) No Limit Texas Hold'em -
2006/12/08-09:35:55.9 (CST)
Table "Makira" (real money) -- Seat 8 is the button
Seat 1: fivepenny ($72.00 in chips)
Seat 2: AA_Boss ($20.25 in chips)
Seat 3: turbojenks ($98.50 in chips)
Seat 4: Bwzzard ($80.80 in chips)
Seat 5: nokia80 ($196.60 in chips)
Seat 6: MaxAA ($207.53 in chips)
Seat 7: Supercam77 ($105.95 in chips)
Seat 8: Russell Byrd ($87.00 in chips)
Seat 9: georgeweah ($167.75 in chips)
Seat 10: menona ($20.00 in chips)
georgeweah: Post Small Blind ($0.50)
menona : Post Big Blind ($1)
Dealing...
Dealt to fivepenny [ 8s ]
Dealt to fivepenny [ 8d ]
fivepenny: Call ($1)
AA_Boss : Fold
turbojenks: Call ($1)
Bwzzard : Call ($1)
nokia80 : Fold
MaxAA : Raise ($6.50)
Supercam77: Fold
Russell Byrd: Call ($6.50)
georgeweah: Fold
menona : Fold
fivepenny: Call ($5.50)
turbojenks: Call ($5.50)
Bwzzard : Call ($5.50)
*** FLOP *** : [ Kc 4d 8h ]
fivepenny: Check
turbojenks: Check
Bwzzard : Check
MaxAA : Bet ($17)
Russell Byrd: Fold
fivepenny: Call ($17)
turbojenks: Fold
Bwzzard : Fold
*** TURN *** : [ Kc 4d 8h ] [ 9s ]
fivepenny: Check
MaxAA : Bet ($130)
fivepenny: Call All-in ($48.50)
*** RIVER *** : [ Kc 4d 8h 9s ] [ Jd ]
*** SUMMARY ***
Pot: $162 | Rake: $3
Board: [ Kc 4d 8h 9s Jd ]
fivepenny bet $72, collected $162, net +$90 (showed hand) [ 8s 8d ]
(three of a kind, eights)
AA_Boss didn't bet (folded)
turbojenks lost $6.50 (folded)
Bwzzard lost $6.50 (folded)
nokia80 didn't bet (folded)
MaxAA bet $153.50, collected $81.50, net -$72 [ Ac Kh ] (a pair of
kings)
Supercam77 didn't bet (folded)
Russell Byrd lost $6.50 (folded)
georgeweah lost $0.50 (folded)
menona lost $1 (folded)

Difference is mole I wanted MaxAA to continue betting the hand for me and I wanted Turbo and Bwzzard to stay in the pot too for the ammount of times that hand would lose with that flop I am prepared to lose my buy in to maximise my return
You make a big deal of the stakes you are playing at, well it appears you are well outwith you comfort zone. I doubt if every one at you table is in the same mind shape
As for book reading I read Sklansky whih teaches the utter basics then I read super system which contradicts everything in Sklansky since then I just learn from my mistakes too.
Perhaps I should try at a higher level but to be honest all I want to do is pay for christmas and the odd holiday

[the mole]

Glceud your patter reeks of the green eyed monster so i can't be bothered with your nonsense any more . it appears you are trying to goad me into an argument of which you do not know what you are speaking about ( the stakes) unless you have played there you simply can't understand the game at that level.

as for "playing out my comfort zone" lol where do you get this shit from. you know nothing of my roll or game so i don't kbnow how you can make a ridiculas comment like that .

anyway heres another one which i'm sure will keep you lying awake......lol, this one leaves me wide open for your wise words but remember its not always about the cards

***** Hand 479746345 *****
25.00/50.00 Texas Hold'em (No Limit ) - 08 December 2006 15:53:58
Table TH 284 (Real /Cash Game )
Seat 2: Mr.Aki (5244.00)
Seat 3: phillyy (0.00)
Seat 4: the mole (5513.00)
Mr.Aki post SB 25.00
the mole post BB 50.00
** Deal **
Mr.Aki [N/A, N/A]
the mole [9h, Ad]
*** Bet Round 1 ***
Mr.Aki Raise to 200.00
the mole Call 200.00
*** Flop(Board): *** : [Jd, 9d, 5c]
*** Bet Round 2 ***
the mole Check
Mr.Aki Bet 250.00
the mole Raise to 500.00
Mr.Aki Raise to 1400.00
the mole Call 1400.00
*** Turn(Board): *** : [Jd, 9d, 5c, Ac]
*** Bet Round 3 ***
the mole Check
Mr.Aki All-in 3644.00
the mole Call 3644.00
*** River(Board): *** : [Jd, 9d, 5c, Ac, 6c]
*** Showdown *** : Rake: 3.00 Total Pot: 10485.00
Mr.Aki [Kd, 2d] Highest card ace Win :0.00
the mole [9h, Ad] Two pair aces and nines Win :10485.00

[glceud]

Thats the only hand you have ever posted that I have replied in the negative. And I still think you played it wrong so lets leave it a that. Unfortunately there is no one else on here playing at your stakes to comment.
Nicely done with the second one you got the maximum return on the best hand and I assume that was the right way to play it as you knew who you were playing against

[lathmeister]

Wow nice pot mole

Wonder if you can post your play for a week or so to see how you are doing, but mind you if you are playing for that amount of money u must be either a great player or a rich man

Do you want to sponsor me

[Valiant23]

I can promise you he's an every day bloke mate.

He took £50 at the start of the year and built it up through the levels.

[davidireland]

Originally Posted by glceud

Unfortunately there is no one else on here playing at your stakes to comment.

I play at these levels m8 and the way the mole played that hand was perfect. When your playing high stakes and 4k in pot...you want to kill it cause you dont want to give the opposite player the chance to win.

4k is better than nothing and i'm sure every single player will agree with this...just say he had of done ur way and a another k popped out....he'd be stuck then m8 and lose everything he had..

Your methods are different to everyones methods like mine....every single person plays there own game and in this case mole got it on the button and what i will say is very well played.

glceud i'm sure your a great player and your methods worth for you...but you cant always play to the exact same way therefore the player at the table will eventually read u.

When playing high stakes...its all about power and i'm sure mole will agree.

If i had of been in moles positon i would of done exact same thing as he done. You cant imagine how stressful it is if you dont play at this level.

David.